10mm update 2 – a partner, a daft vendor policy, and THIS is why “size matters”!


The initial article in this sequence may be found here, and the first update is here.  If you haven’t read them, please do so before continuing with this one, otherwise it won’t make too much sense.  (I mentioned in the first report the problem with fentanyl in combination with other drugs, which is causing immense problems for law enforcement.  A California DA has just confirmed the extent of the problem.  It makes frightening reading.)

I’ve just about finished ordering and/or swapping for the ammunition I’ll use to test 10mm Auto pistols, and I’ve lined up three Glocks – the full-size Glock 20;  the allegedly ‘sub-compact’ (I’d rate it more as a ‘compact’) Glock 29;  and the “extra-full-size” Glock 40, complete with a Swampfox reflex sight.  I’ve also linked up with handgun hunting aficionado Kat Ainsworth Stevens, who’s written extensively about the 10mm Auto (she’s a big fan), and has 1911-type pistols chambered for it.  We’ll get together for a shooting evaluation, and we may even go after a feral hog or two (the round’s plenty powerful enough to take even a big one, and there’s no shortage of them around these parts).  If she has time, I’ll ask Kat to write a guest article for this blog about why she likes the cartridge so much.

However, I ran into one snag when ordering ammunition that has me seeing red.  Underwood Ammo, maker of some highly regarded rounds for the 10mm, has an archaic and utterly unnecessary restriction on new purchasers who use a different mailing address from their delivery address (in my case, a P O Box, because I don’t want possibly sensitive mail delivered to a point where light-fingered layabouts might steal it).  They insist that one sends them a copy of one’s identity document (state ID card, or driver’s license, or passport) to ‘confirm your identity’ before they’ll proceed with your order.  (Why they can’t just do an online inquiry to confirm both addresses, I fail to understand – any credit bureau would be able to tell them that.)

In this day and age of identity theft, which is so commonplace as to be a daily threat to everyone, a policy like theirs is – to say the least – monumentally stupid, if not criminally so.  I’ve had more than a few people tell me that their ID was stolen from a doctor’s office that kept it on file, and many law enforcement agencies – including, AFAIK, all Federal ones – won’t allow their ID’s to be copied at all, to avoid that risk.  For a mere ammo vendor to demand a copy is just plain dumb!!!  Their customers have no assurance that it will be properly disposed of when they’re finished with it, and particularly that no unauthorized person might get hold of it.  None of the vendors that I routinely use have such a requirement, and I’d stop buying from them if they instituted anything like it.

As a result of Underwood Ammo’s terminally misguided policy, I’m canceling my order with them.  Fortunately, I can get the ammo I need from other vendors (take a bow, Buffalo Bore and Tim Sundles, where I’ve been a satisfied customer for many years), so I won’t feel the loss.

Finally, you’ll recall that in the first article of this series, I cited some cop friends who told me bluntly that in their experience, a 9mm service pistol didn’t hit hard enough to stop a hopped-up felon in a hurry – that’s why they were switching to 10mm pistols as ‘backup’ weapons.  An incident in Montgomery County, Maryland, a year ago demonstrates why that’s a problem.  The attacker wasn’t hopped-up on drugs at all, but was mentally disturbed.  The video shows the sheriff’s deputy hitting him ten times at point-blank range (not much more than arm’s length) with rounds from his 9mm service pistol.  (Yes, shot placement was probably an issue, but even so – ten rounds???)  The offender only stopped his attack after the last hit.  In the interim, the deputy took several heavy blows from a big stick the offender was carrying, as did other motorists he assaulted beforehand.  Click over to that report to see the video for yourself.

I continue to have confidence in the 9mm round for general self-defense when a modern, efficient, effective round is used, and I carry it myself.  I know I can put my rounds where they need to go, if push comes to shove.  However, I have to accept that there are times when a smaller, less powerful round just can’t cut it, as illustrated in the video linked above, particularly with imperfect shot placement (something that can affect anybody when the proverbial brown substance hits the rotary air impeller).  If a round is powerful enough to get someone’s attention even with imperfect shot placement, that’s a definite advantage.



  1. The unfortunate truth is no handgun cartridge is a guaranteed stopper if the individual is wired enough. The 30-30 is considered a mild deer cartridge and it has the same energy at 100 yards as a 44 magnum does at the muzzle. There are anecdotal stories out of Texas where 44 magnums have been the issue weapons for certain LEOs of multiple hits without an immediate stop.

  2. I refuse to order from companies that insist that the delivery address must be the same as the billing address. Counter-productive to say the least.

  3. With that much Adrenalin going, shots to the heart with any caliber are not going to incapacitate instantly. This is the reason for the mantra "two to the chest and one to the head".

    1. I know if several ammo vendors who require a copy of your ID to prove age… And at least one had their database hacked!

  4. Of the 10 rounds, any 5 of them would probably have been fatal, but let's get serious: all 12 shots were fired in about 4 seconds, and nobody bleeds out that fast.
    Anywhere after the first two, firing the additional shots to the head would have been well within bounds.
    This lunatic was battering the deputy much of the time the deputy was retreating, and the deputy had backed up what looks to be 30 feet.
    I'm amazed he put up with that much for that long.
    One of those times where a couple of rounds of buckshot to the chest would have been a better choice.

    The nut's family is delusional too.
    I don't care a whit for what someone "used to be like"; when video like this from a bystander, which had been online out in public for months prior to the article, shows a scene like that, the family should have apologized to the officer, and then gone into hiding, out of shame.

    And clearing the shooting should have taken about 10 minutes after the video was released in this case, not four months.

  5. I still get a kick out of the story of a guy shot in the forehead with a .32 refusing to let medical officials remove it as it would place human the scene of the crime.

  6. .45acp proof that old, fat, and slow can still get the job done.
    10mm proof that if you have the ability to swing it, and the accuracy to hit the nail on its head, a bigger hammer is always the correct answer.
    .22lr when what you have can still get the job done, but requires patience and a sharp eye.

  7. I believe in the old West the term, gunfighters 10 seconds began. Even when shot in the heart, a man had 10 seconds before he became unable to pull the trigger. It depended how determined or loco the dying man was but he could still deal death and destruction on those who had killed him.

  8. I have the G20 with a RMR cut and red dot as my daily carry. I have 185gr JHP as the ammo driving it. It is running the same power my 45GAP with 185 gr JHP. The biggest difference is the G20 holds 5 more rounds,

  9. More handgun power will not help you with a doped up bad guy. I've seen a Jihadi on heroin set himself on fire and keep fighting.

    What you need is multiple follow up shots to vital organs or the brain if possible and as Aaron noted, sometimes that is not enough.

    Just keep fighting.

  10. Some years ago, an LAPD off duty officer arrived home where an attempt to carjack her occurred. She made the mistake of announcing she was a cop and demanding he surrender.

    He shot her in the heart with a .357 magnum.

    She proceeded to chase him around her vehicle until she could get a clear shot at him. He died, she lived, and eventually she recovered and went back on duty.

    This incident was witnessed by her roommate from an upstairs window, who then called 911.

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